What's going on with Car #7 (a semi-objective analysis)...

[Illegal_Demon]

Ok I have done a lot of work on this topic. Mainly because I want one (at a great price). I've called and emailed over 150 dealers at night and over the past couple of weekends. Some basics many already know...

1. Only the top 500 Dodge dealerships (based on 2021 overall sales) will get ANY of the 6 SE Last Call cars.
2. All of these are limited in production ranging between 300-1000 units that will get built.
3. Pricing is going for well over MSRP with one of the Black Ghosts purported going for +200K over MSRP according to a guy I talked to at a California dealership. (I doubt this, but +100K I would believe especially out there.)

OK, that's great but what about the elusive Car #7? Well, we have heard from many sources it's currently experiencing production and mechanical delays. The issues range from EPA emissions, and transmission problems, to complications with the lightweight carbon fiber wheels. Whatever it is, we still don't have a release date or much else to go on. A few dealers have said that it will be a 909HP car with a bigger blower and a smaller pulley that runs on E85.

Again, all well and good, but what's next? From recent information from DodgeGarage it has been uncovered that the top 200 sales dealers will get 12 (of the 1-6 SE cars) while the top 201-300 dealers will get 10 SEs and the remaining 301-500 dealers will get 6.

Ok, this next part is conjecture but it fits with some of the other rumors suggesting that 300 SE 7 cars will be made. If that holds true it's likely all 300 top dealers will get 1 each. It's also possible that 500 cars get built where the top 200 dealers get 2 #7 cars each while dealers 201-300 get one. I have repeatedly been told that NONE of the 301-500 dealers will see any 700HP+ cars, which means no 7 cars for them.

Now, after communicating with every Power Broker (96) and a bunch more in the top 200 (thanks Horsepower locater for making those dealers known), these guys are going to GUT anyone who wants ANY of the SE cars. I am also convinced that the few that comprehend a 7th may be coming will be extra severe on ADM. With only 300-500 likely to be built, this is surprising to no one (especially Stellantis).

So let's roll through what pricing COULD look like in the coming months IF Dodge builds this unicorn 7 car.

I will base my market and math on how the Demon landscape looked exactly 5 years ago. I was knee-deep in that acquisition process as well.

With 3312 cars ultimately built, ADMs were still rampant. Could you find an MSRP Demon? Yep. Was it common? Nope. That was especially true as we got into calendar year 2018 when the Demon Hype Machine was in overdrive.

This is a wag, but for sh*ts and grins, I am going to say that 1/6 of the 3312 cars were purchased at MSRP (90k) and another 1/6 were at 50K over. The tails of the distribution if you will. The remaining 2/3 (or middle) of that distribution was somewhere between +5K to 25K, I'd guestimate. If you add all of this up it means that the Avg Demon in 2018 was bought for ~ ~+-105K (avg ADM15k). That number is probably close and remember that's for a production run that included 3312 units...

And, the rough top-end market value that 1st year was probably 50% above that....~150-160K...(e.g Ebay, National Auctions, etc).

So if we draw parallels to this 7 car....at 10-15% of that production (300-500)...I do NOT think it's crazy to think the average 15K markup will be 8-10X that of the Demon due to microscopic supply added to the reality that this is the end of HP ICE! No, I'm not smoking crack...I've heard some of these guys already and the car doesn't even exist...

So if this is a 125K MSRP car, it might (on average) take another 75-125K+ to get one...IF you can convince the dealer owners to NOT buy it for themselves (another trend I kept hearing over and over)... So maybe 225K+ out the door?

What about secondary market value? If we apply the Demon 50% factor we saw in year one, then that would get you to ~300-350K (Think Barret Jackson or high-end BAT premium).

Insane? Yes. Impossible to fathom. Hardly...

Break out the popcorn!

 

[BULL]

 

[drag racer]

I think that's a very well-done what-if analysis . If #7 happens, you know guys like Leno and Hendrick carry around $500k in their wallets, so that may be what it takes to pry the unit away from the dealership owner(s). Plus, a lot of other super-wealthy car collectors that many wouldn't recognize their names.

 

[hell on wheels]

Only one #7 Sema show car.
not available to order.
Is what I understood.

 

[DRAGRCR]

Ok I have done a lot of work on this topic. Mainly because I want one (at a great price). I've called and emailed over 150 dealers at night and over the past couple of weekends. Some basics many already know...

1. Only the top 500 Dodge dealerships (based on 2021 overall sales) will get ANY of the 6 SE Last Call cars.
2. All of these are limited in production ranging between 300-1000 units that will get built.
3. Pricing is going for well over MSRP with one of the Black Ghosts purported going for +200K over MSRP according to a guy I talked to at a California dealership. (I doubt this, but +100K I would believe especially out there.)

OK, that's great but what about the elusive Car #7? Well, we have heard from many sources it's currently experiencing production and mechanical delays. The issues range from EPA emissions, and transmission problems, to complications with the lightweight carbon fiber wheels. Whatever it is, we still don't have a release date or much else to go on. A few dealers have said that it will be a 909HP car with a bigger blower and a smaller pulley that runs on E85.

Again, all well and good, but what's next? From recent information from DodgeGarage it has been uncovered that the top 200 sales dealers will get 12 (of the 1-6 SE cars) while the top 201-300 dealers will get 10 SEs and the remaining 301-500 dealers will get 6.

Ok, this next part is conjecture but it fits with some of the other rumors suggesting that 300 SE 7 cars will be made. If that holds true it's likely all 300 top dealers will get 1 each. It's also possible that 500 cars get built where the top 200 dealers get 2 #7 cars each while dealers 201-300 get one. I have repeatedly been told that NONE of the 301-500 dealers will see any 700HP+ cars, which means no 7 cars for them.

Now, after communicating with every Power Broker (96) and a bunch more in the top 200 (thanks Horsepower locater for making those dealers known), these guys are going to GUT anyone who wants ANY of the SE cars. I am also convinced that the few that comprehend a 7th may be coming will be extra severe on ADM. With only 300-500 likely to be built, this is surprising to no one (especially Stellantis).

So let's roll through what pricing COULD look like in the coming months IF Dodge builds this unicorn 7 car.

I will base my market and math on how the Demon landscape looked exactly 5 years ago. I was knee-deep in that acquisition process as well.

With 3312 cars ultimately built, ADMs were still rampant. Could you find an MSRP Demon? Yep. Was it common? Nope. That was especially true as we got into calendar year 2018 when the Demon Hype Machine was in overdrive.

This is a wag, but for sh*ts and grins, I am going to say that 1/6 of the 3312 cars were purchased at MSRP (90k) and another 1/6 were at 50K over. The tails of the distribution if you will. The remaining 2/3 (or middle) of that distribution was somewhere between +5K to 25K, I'd guestimate. If you add all of this up it means that the Avg Demon in 2018 was bought for ~ ~+-105K (avg ADM15k). That number is probably close and remember that's for a production run that included 3312 units...

And, the rough top-end market value that 1st year was probably 50% above that....~150-160K...(e.g Ebay, National Auctions, etc).

So if we draw parallels to this 7 car....at 10-15% of that production (300-500)...I do NOT think it's crazy to think the average 15K markup will be 8-10X that of the Demon due to microscopic supply added to the reality that this is the end of HP ICE! No, I'm not smoking crack...I've heard some of these guys already and the car doesn't even exist...

So if this is a 125K MSRP car, it might (on average) take another 75-125K+ to get one...IF you can convince the dealer owners to NOT buy it for themselves (another trend I kept hearing over and over)... So maybe 225K+ out the door?

What about secondary market value? If we apply the Demon 50% factor we saw in year one, then that would get you to ~300-350K (Think Barret Jackson or high-end BAT premium).

Insane? Yes. Impossible to fathom. Hardly...

Break out the popcorn!

You are forgetting one thing. There is likely to be an application process. Then Dodge/SRT is going to pick what buyers will get them. So, basically the Buyer will own the allocation. You can take delivery at any dealer you want. Mic Drop.

 

[Magnified]

If they do not do something like an application process with a ridiculously low production number like 300 they will only be bought by the dealership owners and some of the super wealthy (to me, ~ $200K for is just plain nuts). It would be nice if this was treated like a "regular" car for allocations, but that's not possible. This is purely economic theater.

 

[Illegal_Demon]

You are forgetting one thing. There is likely to be an application process. Then Dodge/SRT is going to pick what buyers will get them. So, basically the Buyer will own the allocation. You can take delivery at any dealer you want. Mic Drop.

Out of the 150+ ppl I’ve talked to I have heard zero people saying this is how it will work. You might want to pick up that mic 🎤! 😂

PS I like the idea tho!

 

[Illegal_Demon]

If they do not do something like an application process with a ridiculously low production number like 300 they will only be bought by the dealership owners and some of the super wealthy (to me, ~ $200K for is just plain nuts). It would be nice if this was treated like a "regular" car for allocations, but that's not possible. This is purely economic theater.

View attachment 85906

What makes you conclude they will do a lottery? “wish-casting” is not a thing! Dodge has already showed everyone how they will be doing things in 2023. Using their horsepower locator, Call the dealers that have the car you want and “work” with them on price. (Good luck with that working out for the average Joe.)

And again.. don’t shoot the messenger! 😂

 

[swatdocsc]

https://www.stellpower.com/news-202...elay-the-special-dodge-challenger-sema-debut/

 

[DRAGRCR]

Out of the 150+ ppl I’ve talked to I have heard zero people saying this is how it will work. You might want to pick up that mic 🎤! 😂

PS I like the idea tho!

Ford did this with the GT500. It's not like it has not been done before. I am pretty sure other high-end brands have this as well for certain cars. This is not just something that I thought of. It was mentioned by someone that I believe would have access to inside info. It was said that this was being considered. And the reason was they could then pick and choose who they want to have cars. So, yes, they may want Jay Leno to have one. And, yes, they may want a person that will actually take the car out and race it in the wild as opposed to putting it away to never be seen again. And there was one other significant thing that they wanted as a pre requirement. They will choose whomever they want if they decide to go this way. But you and I will never know because they are not going to reveal the final requirements or the real reasons for their choices.


If you think about it. Let’s say what I say is true and John Doe was chosen. Then he starts shopping around for a Dealer to take delivery. It's his allocation and follows him wherever he chooses to take delivery. The DEALERS will have bid on getting him to go to their dealership. They won't have much leverage to add an ADM. If this is feasible and so on, maybe this might be a way to turn the tables on them................

About 4 weeks ago I already ran this scenario past the GM of a Dealer that I do business with. He said he would give me MSRP for an allocation / sale that he would not have had otherwise (on the #7 HALO Car). He just has to sit there and do a small amount of paperwork and collect the built-in profit and the holdback and do what? Dealer prep the car and put it in the show room and increase the foot traffic in his dealership and so on......

 

[Illegal_Demon]

Ford did this with the GT500. It's not like it has not been done before. I am pretty sure other high-end brands have this as well for certain cars. This is not just something that I thought of. It was mentioned by someone that I believe would have access to inside info. It was said that this was being considered. And the reason was they could then pick and choose who they want to have cars. So, yes, they may want Jay Leno to have one. And, yes, they may want a person that will actually take the car out and race it in the wild as opposed to putting it away to never be seen again. And there was one other significant thing that they wanted as a pre requirement. They will choose whomever they want if they decide to go this way. But you and I will never know because they are not going to reveal the final requirements or the real reasons for their choices.


If you think about it. Let’s say what I say is true and John Doe was chosen. Then he starts shopping around for a Dealer to take delivery. It's his allocation and follows him wherever he chooses to take delivery. The DEALERS will have bid on getting him to go to their dealership. They won't have much leverage to add an ADM. If this is feasible and so on, maybe this might be a way to turn the tables on them................

About 4 weeks ago I already ran this scenario past the GM of a Dealer that I do business with. He said he would give me MSRP for an allocation / sale that he would not have had otherwise (on the #7 HALO Car). He just has to sit there and do a small amount of paperwork and collect the built-in profit and the holdback and do what? Dealer prep the car and put it in the show room and increase the foot traffic in his dealership and so on......

Sounds like something that would be great for the customer. That said, I personally doubt it plays out that way. Dealers are taking deposits on the #7 Car and I have spoken to two regional reps in the last week (one who has direct access to Tim K). He said the top 200-300 dealers would get 1 car and top 200 dealerships -might- get more than one. Not once did I hear anything about an intricate lottery/application process. I am pretty sure some of these guys would know something and like you, I have a couple of relatively high-up connections and so far I've heard Nada. It would be refreshing but I just don't see it happening. I see this car (and all SE last call cars for that matter) as a "high-profit gifts" to the best-performing dealerships who, on average, are NOT happy about the abrupt 100% swap to EV.

Like you said though, to some extent we all are making educated guesses right now. I hope you are right, but personally, I just don't think it goes down like that, especially after seeing how Last Call cars 1-6 were allocated, with almost ALL of them going for big-time premiums over MSRP to the top Dodge shops across the country. Why would car 7 be any different?

Guess we will all find out together in the coming months.

 

[1971demon]

Sounds like something that would be great for the customer. That said, I personally doubt it plays out that way. Dealers are taking deposits on the #7 Car and I have spoken to two regional reps in the last week (one who has direct access to Tim K). He said the top 200-300 dealers would get 1 car and top 200 dealerships -might- get more than one. Not once did I hear anything about an intricate lottery/application process. I am pretty sure some of these guys would know something and like you, I have a couple of relatively high-up connections and so far I've heard Nada. It would be refreshing but I just don't see it happening. I see this car (and all SE last call cars for that matter) as a "high-profit gifts" to the best-performing dealerships who, on average, are NOT happy about the abrupt 100% swap to EV.

Like you said though, to some extent we all are making educated guesses right now. I hope you are right, but personally, I just don't think it goes down like that, especially after seeing how Last Call cars 1-6 were allocated, with almost ALL of them going for big-time premiums over MSRP to the top Dodge shops across the country. Why would car 7 be any different?

Guess we will all find out together in the coming months.

Hmmmm...I'm gettin a headache

 

[Illegal_Demon]

Hmmmm...I'm gettin a headache

Well your Amherst dealer is not the top 100, 200 or 500 in National sales. I totally understand why you might be getting that headache! 😂

 

[Magnified]

What makes you conclude they will do a lottery? “wish-casting” is not a thing! Dodge has already showed everyone how they will be doing things in 2023. Using their horsepower locator, Call the dealers that have the car you want and “work” with them on price. (Good luck with that working out for the average Joe.)

And again.. don’t shoot the messenger! 😂

I am not saying they will. Saying they should in my opinion. Otherwise just a rich man's toy. Things like that won't grow middleclass interest in fast cars or racing. Look at the stands. In the US if you're not Nascar w lots of tide money your base has been shrinking for years. And that's not the only consideration of course, just one.

 

[MJS73]

I've heard there will be a lottery and you must be a current Demon owner to enter the lottery.

 

[Speedy!]

So they're having engine failures (and a bunch of them) at only 900HP? What's up with that?

 

[vortecd]

So they're having engine failures (and a bunch of them) at only 900HP? What's up with that?

They didn't hire Jon as the tuner

 

[DRAGRCR]

So they're having engine failures (and a bunch of them) at only 900HP? What's up with that?

Sounds like they are putting the engine through full production durability testing. I see this as a good thing. It will ensure that I can beat on the Car,all day long without issues just like a stock Demon , AND they may be planning on building more than just a handfull of them.

 

[2ndAmend]

Ok, so help me if I misunderstood anything. About a year ago when Stellantis took over they quickly disbanded the SRT team and sent them to different divisions including overseas to do something like spread the knowledge/skills/expertise/something like that.

Now Dodge is rumored to be building a 909hp monster, but by whom??? The second string??? They had the team who could do the impossible and unthinkable and they deliberately destroyed it! Looking at what these guys are doing to CDJR, I don’t think I’d ever buy another. Stellantis will be the death of CDJR.

I am happy I have mine, but worried about future parts and service….

 

[DavidKFla]