Transmission tuning for quicker shifts.

[jonx96]

Here is my 1 to 2 shift fill time stock. All I did was -10 from the lower rpm ranges. from 86 deg over. Sounds like we had a similar thought process here.
But this shows why it is important to get your trans temp up before making a pass.
Edit- I left normal stock but that's just preference

 

[Speedy!]

Yellow is expected torque, orange is actual torque.

My graphs don't look like yours for those values:

 

[fumanchu182]

That is correct, that looks look a WOT pull, my pull was partial throttle.

 

[Speedy!]

Aaaah, I missed that part, got it.

 

[jonx96]

@fumanchu182 Have you been playing with slip times at all? I have also made some adjustments to that table.
Also I find it a bit crazy for TQM with these trans to cut power for shifts. Seems pretty crazy cutting fuel on a boosted vehicle. I have read on the hp tuners forum some say this is safe and needed for big hp vehicles. Well I had someone send me a datalog a few weeks ago of a car someone else tuned and well it cut fuel and it blew through the shift and it kept cutting fuel hoping it would shift. It was for about a second but at 6700 rpms and fuel cuts out for a second well no good. I was surprised the car lived through it.

For anyone reading this I just leave use spark on. This is a factory tune leaving FSO on

 

[fumanchu182]

@fumanchu182 Have you been playing with slip times at all? I have also made some adjustments to that table.
Also I find it a bit crazy for TQM with these trans to cut power for shifts. Seems pretty crazy cutting fuel on a boosted vehicle. I have read on the hp tuners forum some say this is safe and needed for big hp vehicles. Well I had someone send me a datalog a few weeks ago of a car someone else tuned and well it cut fuel and it blew through the shift and it kept cutting fuel hoping it would shift. It was for about a second but at 6700 rpms and fuel cuts out for a second well no good. I was surprised the car lived through it.

For anyone reading this I just leave use spark on. This is a factory tune leaving FSO on
View attachment 68840

same here i disabled all but “Use Spark”, the theory is that the rest are too intrusive. Hell for ETC to even activate you’d have to be almost close to nuking the car temp wise, by then other safeties will already be activated.

 

[Speedy!]

Yeah pulling fuel at shift is bad IMO. I turned that off after I saw a lean condition at shift and couldn't figure out why. The injectors were shutting off. I don't know why they did that on stock vehicles, seems very bad to me.

 

[Hpindy]

@fumanchu182 Have you been playing with slip times at all? I have also made some adjustments to that table.
Also I find it a bit crazy for TQM with these trans to cut power for shifts. Seems pretty crazy cutting fuel on a boosted vehicle. I have read on the hp tuners forum some say this is safe and needed for big hp vehicles. Well I had someone send me a datalog a few weeks ago of a car someone else tuned and well it cut fuel and it blew through the shift and it kept cutting fuel hoping it would shift. It was for about a second but at 6700 rpms and fuel cuts out for a second well no good. I was surprised the car lived through it.

For anyone reading this I just leave use spark on. This is a factory tune leaving FSO on
View attachment 68840

Same here I disable all fuel cut offs . That's nuts on a boosted engine . I tried using the throttle blade closing with the spark but it was too dramatic sometimes .. so I disabled that too and only use spark now .

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[jonx96]

I'm trying to think of some other tops we can talk about here. Not much info out there on these trans and learning them takes a lot of time of trying to fiddle your way through things.
Pressures are pretty simple. Like a hard shift add pressure. Don't want a hard shift take pressure away Having a shift flare maybe try some more pressure.
@Hpindy I am wondering if the throttle blade opening and closing is a slower process than taking spark and fuel away. Maybe that's why from the factory they chose not to use it and pull fuel instead. I would think spark alone though could have accomplished what they wanted.



Here are the tables to play with how much power you want torque management to kick in

 

[Hpindy]

I'm trying to think of some other tops we can talk about here. Not much info out there on these trans and learning them takes a lot of time of trying to fiddle your way through things.
Pressures are pretty simple. Like a hard shift add pressure. Don't want a hard shift take pressure away Having a shift flare maybe try some more pressure.
@Hpindy I am wondering if the throttle blade opening and closing is a slower process than taking spark and fuel away. Maybe that's why from the factory they chose not to use it and pull fuel instead. I would think spark alone though could have accomplished what they wanted.



Here are the tables to play with how much power you want torque management to kick in
View attachment 68851

Some times it would close the throttle blade so hard I almost hit the steering wheel. It was pretty sudden.. if it was gradual it might have worked better.

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[fumanchu182]

I'm trying to think of some other tops we can talk about here. Not much info out there on these trans and learning them takes a lot of time of trying to fiddle your way through things.
Pressures are pretty simple. Like a hard shift add pressure. Don't want a hard shift take pressure away Having a shift flare maybe try some more pressure.
@Hpindy I am wondering if the throttle blade opening and closing is a slower process than taking spark and fuel away. Maybe that's why from the factory they chose not to use it and pull fuel instead. I would think spark alone though could have accomplished what they wanted.



Here are the tables to play with how much power you want torque management to kick in
View attachment 68851

I have only messed with the Nominal Slip. And yes tables 47106 and such have been modified. Reduced by 25% but no more.

 

[Speedy!]

One thing to remember on some of these torque mgmt tables is we now have modified cars making more torque than factory. So I was careful with the torque mgmt. Taking away 300ft/lbs at a shift on a stock car making 650ft/lbs is one thing, taking 300 away from a car making 1000ft/lbs is different. I tuned mine, but I can't remember how I came up with the values. I think I compared a 2019 RE and Demon Crate to what I had and came up with a compromise.

 

[Hpindy]

One thing to remember on some of these torque mgmt tables is we now have modified cars making more torque than factory. So I was careful with the torque mgmt. Taking away 300ft/lbs at a shift on a stock car making 650ft/lbs is one thing, taking 300 away from a car making 1000ft/lbs is different. I tuned mine, but I can't remember how I came up with the values. I think I compared a 2019 RE and Demon Crate to what I had and came up with a compromise.

I watch the "expected torque " and " actual torque" in my logs and I only go about 50nm above what I see on the logs . I never max it out .


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[Speedy!]

I don't know how to correlate all that yet so this is good discussion for me. Mine always says expected torque 804 at WOT but actual is always like 5XX under power. At shifts timing gets pulled which I do understand and actual torque drops accordingly to the high 2XX for a blip while the shift takes place but all that is separate from the table Jon posted.

 

[jonx96]

Right we are talking about two different torque managements here.
That’s why I didn’t post any recommended values because the fastest value is one thing. A safeish value is another.
Also like you say if you make 1000 lbs ft of torque your trans won’t last long even with stock torque management. Take torque management away even less time. Add torque management you may have a chance. It’s all in what you want.
it’s why I don’t post my recommended changes 😂
Because recommended changes are different for everyone.

 

[fumanchu182]

I posted my logs and tune on this thread https://www.hellcatforum.org/threads/live-action-from-fumanchu182.6592/page-33#post-248364 just in case anyone wants to review.